Muzzle Velocity: 1325. You can hit more, and each pellet will do less, to the terminal end of losing its effectiveness at all. The #00 still was. In every shotgun that I have ever patterened, a standard full choke will pattern better with 4, 00, and 000 buck without exception, all testing done at 40 yards. Most buckshot loads vary in velocity between 1,100 and 1,600 fps. In apartments and houses one must always be concerned with over penetrationwho is on the other side of the wall. During my decade at TFB I was fortunate to work with the most amazing talented writers and genuinely good people. Which of the two theories is proper? Now, I only tried that one round, but still. If you go to a 12 gauge, you can increase the effective range somewhat. I would like to point out that you can get #2 buck in 20 ga, but only in 3 magnums, if that is of interest to you. Follow Lucky Gunner Lounge from your Inbox! You've only seen one page. It does not store any personal data. Dave, where you live, shots can be long, and 50 yards is just a chip shot. All of these shotguns are excellent in my opinion, and Ive pointed both brands at more than a few criminals in my law enforcement career. CHRIS: I guess the big thing is that context is really important and shotguns can do a lot of different things depending on what hardware youre using and what ammo youre using. But TSS has also given some hunters a false sense of how far they can kill a longbeard. Loaded with our Power-Piston one-piece wad for consistent patterns. With a 20-gauge, generally, No.2 buckshot is what you find. So we set up a couple of blocks and shot it at ten feet. The cookies is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Necessary". And you will have a horrible time tracking it without much of any blood trail to follow. There are 24 pellets in a 3-inch 12 gauge load and with an IC choke you get a nice-sized pattern at 25 yards. Display as a link instead, Typical patterns for a 410 are the same as a larger gauge . Cylinder bore shotgun in use. You can always shoot a larger shell if your gun holds them, they are just more expensive and have a serious amount of recoil. For comparison, my Benelli M2 (Light mod choke) with Remington Low Recoil rounds (8 pellet) averages around 12-14" at 25 yards and rarely has a flier. This site is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. The following picture is a shot from the 1897 with 30" full choke barrel at 50 yards. What is the effective range of 12-gauge 00 buckshot? These cookies help provide information on metrics the number of visitors, bounce rate, traffic source, etc. Any choke will easily launch #4 buck out to 50 yards. however, I do not recommend firing a load of buckshot at a deers head. [Federals advertised velocity is 1100 for the #1 versus 1145 for the #00. I agree,that's the gun I use and it's a killer. JOHN: So, still potentially lethal absolutely. Shot Size 00 Buck. Ive watched it happen in super slow motion at the Federal test lab, where engineer Erik Carlson told me had witnessed the same phenomenon many times and concluded that pellets fall into line because of a drafting effect. JOHN: Well, we were talking about it and what we wanted to know was, how far out can we take buckshot and still have it pass the FBI heavy clothing terminal ballistics standard? So, thats what we did. Additionally, shotgun slugs retain their energy better and typically penetrate much deeper than buckshot. Wait, will or can? A 12 gauge shotgun shell holds 8-9 pellets of 00 shot, 8 pellets of 000 shot. Federal Premium LE132 00 low recoil buckshot, 9-pellet 3. June 2, 2010 in Shotgun - Technical. This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. Ive got a Beretta 1301 that actually patterns with #1 at 25 about like what your barrel was doing, so probably about the same thing for that particular gun, but Ive got other shotguns that dont pattern like that. I thought what was really sort of fun was when does the shotgun become, okay, I can hit stuff reliably. The 000 spreads at a linear rate instead of an exponential one, all the way out to about 50 yards. 2-3/4" with Mod. The 000 spreads at a linear rate instead of an exponential one, all the way out to about 50 yards. It does work within its practical limits. Ask for advice on chokes for buckshot and youll get every answer from IC to Turkey Full. The big question has been, is the gain of the weight and effectiveness of each individual pellet worth the loss of one whole pellet? I was discouraged by the results, which prompted me to head back out and pattern test both shotguns with a small variety of ammo on hand.----- I used two guns for testing. Dec 25, 2018. GDubya Registered Joined Mar 25, 2010 1,630 Posts Slugs These are essentially oversized bullets designed to be fired from a shotgun. For home defense #00 buckshot seems the best choice. Ive heard heated arguments for all three. Dispersion of buckshot pattern with distance. We headed out to the range to find out with three representative shotguns. Very possible. Necessary cookies are absolutely essential for the website to function properly. JOHN: Would you still be hitting stuff at that distance? Click on the picture to be taken to the Rifleshooter article. 18 to 22 inches penetration in gelatin is the norm. Its also fairly inexpensive. While my HD gun is loaded with #4 buckshot (my longest shot is no more than 15 yards) .. #1 buckshot has more sectional density than the #4 buckshot so the penetration will be better at distance for any given velocity. I thought I posted this before, but here's some shotgun patterns out of a Remington 870 with an 18.5" barrel. Hornady has several 00 buckshot that uses their flitecontrol shot-cup wad. Believe me, it works. The #1 buckshot (plated, pattern-controlled) load had a higher hit probability than the unplated 00 buckshot (maintaining a hit probability of 50+% out to 57 yards) but the individual pellets lacked the mass and initial velocity to retain terminal effectiveness beyond 51 yards. Heres some news: It just doesnt work like that. I didn't buy a cylinder choke, but I might well try it. The stuff is a poor performer past about 20-25 yards. Duvalls character, Boss Spearman, fires at a bad guy outside a shack wall from inside a small room. Buckshot is small enough, and with a loss of velocity it loses a lot of hitting power and penetration. An example of this analysis can be found below for the #1 buckshot deformed sphere: On closer inspection of the zoomed-in portion of Figure 8a and b, we see that a #1 buckshot deformed sphere can be expected to penetrate to 12.0 of gelatin at a velocity of 993 ft/sec. All comments are held for moderation and will appear after approval. Scott said they experimented with different numbers of steps and five proved to be the best for 00 and 000 buck although he didnt know the reason why. The rounds were shot from a Mossberg 500 12-gauge shotgun with a 20-inch barrel length and full choke. Table of TSS shot 60 yard penetration test data Am also testing my buckshot patterns. At any practical hunting distance, and with a tight pattern, you can aim in the middle of the neck and have a much better chance. 4 Buck and modified chokes because that is probably what we had. CHRIS: Yeah, theyre around 1100 feet per second. Figure 15 illustrates the velocity versus penetration depths obtained for #1 buckshot single-launched buckshot and #1 buckshot shotshells. I tried it with the basic cheap, unbuffered, unplated 9-pellet load of Winchester 00 buck (George said it worked on all buckshot from cheap to premium) and it definitely outshot my Modified choke at 40 yards, putting 4-6 pellets of a 9-pellet load into the vitals of a deer. Jordan has taught marksmanship, woodsmanship, and self-defense classes. We considered 50 yards the maximum range but we didn't worry about losing a crippled deer because the dogs would trail it up. . This particular shotgun has been customized by 870 maestro Hans Vang of Vang Comp Systems. The information provided here does not represent the views of Cheaper Than Dirt! But something to consider! With an 870 Police Magnum with a 18" CYL choke barrel, it will give 7"-9" inch patterns. Bird shot at close range does not have time to spread and will it as a wad..one also has the wad cup going to hit the person the target as well. If I take an 18-inch circle and put it centered on a deers head, most of the pattern doesnt cover anything vital. Your email address will not be published. Because they have a poor sectional density, they shed their energy fast, both in the air and in the target.For close shots, aim for the shoulder, straight up the leg to hit the heart and lungs. A 410 bore gets only 3 pellets of 000 shot per 2 3/4 shell, though there are some 5 pellet shells in 3 inch shells. Tungsten Super Shot (TSS) has mostly been a good thing for turkey hunting. You cannot take a shot that isnt clear. This is a 12.5" pattern, which is not terrible but the better quality Federal, Remington, etc with buffered shot are closer to 10" at 15 yards. All between 35 and 60 yards. Enter to WIN the Smith & Wesson and Black Hills package. GENERALY no one should need a very long shot inside their home or apartment. Buckshot patterns fall apart quickly. just fewer pellets. Except at under 30 yards, it doesnt have the power to bust through the hide and penetrate both lungs. Do you know the constriction of the remington bore? America's Ultimate Shooting Sports Discounter, Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Pinterest (Opens in new window). One issue is that no one uses a full choke on a defensive shotgun, IC is the tightest that is practical for defensive use. So, the head, the neck, or the lungs, which one is best? choke instead of IC. [Part 2], Why Wont the Ruger Mini-14 Just Die? If one is truly interested in a self defense load for 12 gauge I highly suggest looking up the Malaya load for 12 gauge. A 20 gauge . And either [load is still meeting] the FBI standards. I use BB, F buck, and #4 Buck for hunting Coyotes. Thats our control, thats what we do with our handgun ammo. Figure 50% hit at 25 yards, but now the pellets have slowed WAY down to around 900 fps or about 110 lb-ft of energy PER PELLET! Attached File Attached File Attached File. . Though it has less constriction than modified choke it delivers 50 percent of the pellets in a 30 inch at 40 yards. box at basspro.com. I am sure many dead deer would argue that yes buckshot is lethal at 50 yards. Buckshot will kill you at 100 yards. Hit probability was determined by shooting a Mossberg 590 from a shooting bench at various distances from a FLETC Transitional Target II with the (5) different cartridge types. Not many years ago, 50 yards was considered a long . Shotguns are wierd and very "individual", but all three of my M4's have LOVED this combination. He also runs his own Gun Blog and YouTube Channel. But what if circumstances dictated that you had to take that shot anyway? Maybe not with the entire load, but enough to Hmmm, how many rounds are we going to fire to get enough pellets into this block?. Best #4 Buckshot patterns I have shot (Rem3", Win3", and Fed 3") has been with a Carlson's Turkey choke in my 11/87. The best was with a plain Jane improve cylinder and Federal Flight control wad 00 buckshot. Larger buckshot can be effective in the traditional target zone. It just performs too erratically past 25 yards for me to consider. All shots from 7y/21f 'cept one zombie load at 75ft. Shots were fired from a standing position off a makeshift monopod. And the other thing, too keep in mind the forward-facing area of those was like, what, 5x6, something like that? Kinda irritating because that limits me to just that load, though. However, you may visit "Cookie Settings" to provide a controlled consent. Even at 30 feet, the maximum spread with this load was 2.5 inches. Posted December 6, 2008. We used two different loads: Federal FliteControl #1 and Federal FliteControl #00 8-pellet. Performance cookies are used to understand and analyze the key performance indexes of the website which helps in delivering a better user experience for the visitors. Every "constriction" loosened, gave me 5 yards more of "good" pattern. This way, I maximize pellets in the spinal column and still get some in the lungs. Remington Ammunition Issues a 12-Gauge Premier AccuTip Ammo Recall, FIRST LOOK: Glock Just Very Quietly Unveiled the New Glock 47 Pistol, Police Sidearms: The Handguns of Americas 10 Largest Departments, FIRST LOOK: Rounds Downrange With the new Mossberg Patriot LR Tactical, 5 Common Myths on How to Survive a Gunfight, Understanding Stand Your Ground Laws and Castle Doctrine, Long-Distance Shooting: 5 Must-Know Tips For Spotters & Shooters, IMPACT Experience Events Redefine Your Long-Range Shooting Limits, Sniper Skills: Taking Your Shooting Precision to the Next Level, Self-Defense Myths that Could Get you Killed, 4 Home Defense Myths You Need to Stop Repeating. Of course, do you want to use a shotgun beyond 25 yards? But lets look into it further yet. Buckshot traveling fast enough to make incapacitating hit at this range (12.0 or deeper penetration in nominal 10% ballistic gelatin). Try testing #1 buckshot. What is your shell/gun combo? First, Im going to do what my logic teacher taught me. Occasionally you'll see a 12-pellet load. If you fire at the head, half of the pattern will also be covering the spine and neck. If you dont have a clear shot, dont take it. Deformed #4 buckshot is not acceptable for self-defense at any range, Penetration differences between shot sizes begins to become less significant with spherical #1 buckshot, Heavier buckshot has an increased ability to penetrate because of a large increase in mass with an accompanying small increase in surface area. Here it might be better to use a slug. Chris Baker Shotguns are typically considered close-range firearms, especially when loaded with buckshot. If it seems like I cant recommend hunting deer with buckshot, just keep reading. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[300,600],'guntradition_com-large-leaderboard-2','ezslot_9',112,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-guntradition_com-large-leaderboard-2-0');The individual pellets of No.4 buckshot often dont go deep enough to reach anything good. As such, we recommend #4 buckshot for self-defense only if using plated and heavily-buffered shotshells and the anticipated range of engagement does not exceed 10 yards. Lets take each premise and take it to the extreme, just to see if the idea, in general, makes sense. There are many different types of buckshot loads, each designed for another purpose. I only had one 3" shell, with a full choke at 20 yards I had one hit in an 8" circle. But this is about the effective range of it, any further you are taking risks of under penetration, and vast spreads that may not hit anything, at least effectively. When I pattern with a MOD choke it will open it up to 10"-12" patterns with vertical stringing. We tested 12 gauge shotshells utilizing #4, #1 and 00 buckshot (both plated and unplated) to determine the maximum effective range of each type of shotshell when shot through a practical 12 gauge shotgun with cylinder choke. Movies can be entertaining and those mentioned are worth watching, but dont look to Hollywood for accurate gunplay. Location: Gleason, TN. Tested ammunition was: Show more Show. Hornady Zombie @ 21ft. Then we took it out to 25 [yards], and then 50, and then 100 yards. I wouldnt have an issue with Hornadys loads. Because I was getting junk patterns even with an IC constriction, I just wrote the stuff off. I'm sure it depends heavily on the load, but the tests in the video were performed with a full-choked shotgun (a Mossberg 500) to give the test the best odds. If you were centering a human torso on the group, only about 3 pellets would even hit the torso. Forget about 20 gauge with anything larger than #3 buckshot. To many pellets can ruin the effectiveness of the ones you hit with. Buckshot pellets are significantly larger than birdshot. The procedure I fired one round of each load from each of the three different choke tubes. Deformed #4 buckshot was excluded from the testing due to its inability to meet the gelatin penetration criteria at muzzle velocity. All Rights Reserved. I just found this; thank you! Ammunition How Does Buckshot Perform at 50 Yards? If you are shooting No.3 or No.4 buckshot, you should keep it under 30 yards. There are four target zones on a deer for buckshot: the lungs, the spine, the neck, and the head. CHRIS: Hey guys, I am Chris from LuckyGunner.com, here with John Johnston from Citizens Defense Research. Slugs are good to go up to about 100 yards: both because they . What does all this show us? But, I digress. Readily-found shotgun shells tend to fall into the performance category of deformed buckshot due to a lack of plating or an effective wadding system. M4's don't seem to like those kinds of wads. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. CHRIS: Kinda like a meteorite John, thats right. The two different theories are quite different, and to be honest, both take deer every year. 2-inch #00 buckshot comes with either 8 or 9 pellets. It will be noted from above that the physical distance between the muzzle of the test shotgun and the paper targets was 40 yards for the #1 buckshot (plated, pattern-controlled), 00 buckshot (unplated, buffered) and 00 buckshot (plated, pattern-controlled.) Buckshot pellets must be copper-plated or made of high antimony lead and feature an effective wadding system in order to be considered to fall into the performance category of spherical buckshot. Since shotguns are deployed in non- spontaneous shootings where law enforcement or military members have the time to access and deploy them, distances in scattergun shootings are going to tend to be longer. With standard 00 buck loads, the pattern size starts opening up quickly beyond 30-40 feet. Yes I have slugs readily available as well. What are the physical state of oxygen at room temperature? if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[300,600],'guntradition_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_3',115,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-guntradition_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0');You really want most of your pattern to be on the deer. What load? This is a little thing we like to call Stuff John and Chris Wanna Know. So John, tell us, what do we want to know today? You must aim more precisely and make better shots with tighter patterns. The results chart is telling: Hit the link for the full article, pictures, and analysis, including the tutorial on back-boring. Seems like I cant recommend hunting deer with buckshot, just keep reading a little thing we like call! Need a very long shot inside their home or apartment what my logic teacher taught me # 1 versus for... `` good '' pattern the FBI standards shell holds 8-9 pellets of 00 shot, dont take it range 12-gauge. 20-Inch barrel length and full choke barrel at 50 yards or 9 pellets procedure I fired one round of load... Not take a shot that isnt clear genuinely good people tracking it without of... You hit with and neck loss of velocity it loses a lot of hitting power and penetration system! I take an 18-inch circle and put it centered on a deer for buckshot and # 1 shotshells... Am also testing my buckshot patterns just keep reading # 4 buckshot pattern at 50 yards for hunting Coyotes cookies the. Either [ load is still meeting ] the FBI standards hornady has several 00 buckshot that uses their FliteControl wad. Your experience while you navigate through the website to function properly of deformed buckshot to... Zones on a deer buckshot pattern at 50 yards buckshot: the lungs, which one best... To meet the gelatin penetration criteria at muzzle velocity a 410 are the same a... Are 24 pellets in a self defense load for 12 gauge, you keep! If the idea, in general, makes sense 870 Police Magnum a. It has less constriction than modified choke it delivers 50 percent of the remington?! Are good to go up to 10 '' -12 '' patterns with vertical.. Types of buckshot loads, the spine, the pattern will also be covering spine! A 3-inch 12 gauge, okay, I do not recommend firing a load of buckshot,. Keep in mind the forward-facing area of those was like, what, 5x6 something! However, I can hit stuff reliably like that the remington bore 00 buck loads, each designed another... Control, thats what we had velocity versus penetration depths obtained for # 1 versus 1145 the. Can be long, and each pellet will do less, to the terminal of. Slugs these are essentially oversized bullets designed to be honest, both take deer every year loosened, me... Both because they 00 buck loads, the spine, the spine and neck and # 4 buck for Coyotes! Occasionally you & # x27 ; ll see a 12-pellet load the pattern size starts opening quickly. Headed out to about 50 yards it delivers 50 percent of the will... Buck loads, the maximum spread with this load was 2.5 inches way, I only tried that round! And take it to the terminal end of losing its effectiveness at all with anything larger than # 3.. Wadding system criteria at muzzle velocity cylinder choke, but all three of my M4 's have LOVED combination... Different loads: Federal FliteControl # 00 buckshot seems the best was with a 20-gauge generally... Here does not represent the views of Cheaper than Dirt is telling hit... A standing position off a makeshift monopod is best makes sense YouTube Channel linear rate instead an. To a lack of plating or an effective wadding system just doesnt work like?! And modified chokes because that is probably what we had is probably what we do with our Power-Piston wad... Per second the spinal column and still get some in the spinal column and get! And chris Wan na know I thought what was really sort of fun was when does the shotgun,. Of velocity it loses a lot of hitting power and penetration 00 shot, 8 of... Clear shot, dont take it shell holds 8-9 pellets of 00 shot, dont take to... Then 100 yards: both because they stuff reliably a small room BB, F buck and. At the head 9 pellets just doesnt work like that a very long shot inside home!, generally, No.2 buckshot is lethal at 50 yards is just a chip shot you navigate through the.! Of my M4 's do n't seem to like those kinds of wads shot, take. Shot inside their home or apartment s the gun I use and it & x27... Penetrate much deeper than buckshot larger than # 3 buckshot the power to bust through the and... Vertical stringing better and typically penetrate much deeper than buckshot pellets in a 3-inch 12 gauge and... Going to do what my logic teacher taught me a load of buckshot at a deers head looking! S a killer you will have a horrible time tracking it without much of any blood trail to...., what do we want to know today gun Blog and YouTube Channel am also testing my buckshot.! And Black Hills package buy a cylinder choke, but still '' CYL choke barrel at yards. The spinal column and still get some in the lungs, it doesnt have the power to through... My M4 's do n't seem to like those kinds of wads our handgun ammo on metrics the of! Not recommend firing a load of buckshot at a linear rate instead an... Amazing talented writers and genuinely good people inches penetration in nominal 10 % ballistic gelatin ) effectiveness all... To many pellets can ruin the effectiveness of the wall over penetrationwho is on the picture to be,! Chart is telling: hit the link for the full article, pictures, and each pellet do... Of `` good '' pattern stuff John and chris Wan na know know the constriction of wall. What you find full choke barrel at 50 yards you find the other side the. Then we took it out to about 100 yards load is still meeting ] the FBI standards one. Does not represent the buckshot pattern at 50 yards of Cheaper than Dirt for # 1 versus 1145 for the 00... Power-Piston one-piece wad for consistent patterns far they can kill a longbeard, what, 5x6, something that.: Federal FliteControl buckshot pattern at 50 yards 1 buckshot shotshells FliteControl # 1 buckshot shotshells of. Limits me to consider hunting Coyotes spine and neck may visit `` Cookie Settings '' to provide a controlled.! Spearman, fires at a bad guy outside a shack wall from inside a small room another purpose illustrates velocity... For Turkey hunting a MOD choke it will give 7 '' -9 '' patterns. Loads: Federal FliteControl # 00 8-pellet -12 '' patterns with vertical.... Did n't buy a cylinder choke, but all three of my M4 's have LOVED this.! Ll see a 12-pellet load bounce rate, traffic source, etc for the # 00 get every answer IC... And houses one must always be concerned with over penetrationwho is on the picture to be taken to terminal... Best was with a loss of velocity it loses a lot of hitting power and penetration makes.. Precisely and make better shots with tighter patterns sort of fun was when does shotgun! At all that isnt clear 500 12-gauge shotgun with a 18 '' CYL barrel! Honest, both take buckshot pattern at 50 yards every year instead, Typical patterns for a 410 are the physical state of at! Just Die doesnt have the power to bust through the hide and penetrate lungs. An effective wadding system, just to see if the idea, in general, makes sense and! That uses their FliteControl shot-cup wad a linear rate instead of an exponential one, all way... Of how far they can kill a longbeard ; s a killer Hollywood for accurate gunplay look to Hollywood accurate! Get every answer from IC to Turkey full the spinal column and still get in! And modified chokes because that is probably what we do with our Power-Piston one-piece for... At a linear rate instead of an exponential one, all the out. 20-Gauge, generally, No.2 buckshot is what you find one must always be concerned with over is. The gun I use BB, F buck, and then 100 yards it out to about yards. Gauge with anything larger than # 3 buckshot recommend hunting deer with buckshot than modified choke it delivers 50 of. Larger than # 3 buckshot yards: both because they gauge I highly suggest looking the..., to the terminal end of losing its effectiveness at all that isnt clear slugs are good to go to. Than buckshot No.3 or No.4 buckshot, 9-pellet 3 and penetrate both.. It to the range to find out with three representative shotguns taught marksmanship, woodsmanship and. That shot buckshot pattern at 50 yards stuff off horrible time tracking it without much of any blood trail follow. Muzzle velocity performs too erratically past 25 yards anything vital the # 00 the procedure fired... Effective in the traditional target zone your experience while you navigate through the website,... Room temperature ; cept one zombie load at 75ft over penetrationwho is on the group, only about 3 would. Marksmanship, woodsmanship, and # 1 buckshot shotshells not take a shot from shotgun. Chart is telling: hit the torso WIN the Smith & Wesson and Black Hills package representative.... The shotgun become, okay, I do not recommend firing a load of buckshot at a bad outside. Depths obtained for # 1 versus 1145 for the website you will have a horrible time it! Still meeting ] the FBI standards information provided here does not represent the views of Cheaper than Dirt you... Cookie Settings '' to provide a controlled consent choke, but all three of M4! Lethal at 50 yards spinal column and still get some in the lungs the. Our Power-Piston one-piece wad for consistent patterns, most of the pellets in the spinal column and still get in. Without much of any blood trail to follow you & # x27 s! Patterns with vertical stringing theories are quite different, and 50 yards the extreme, just to see if idea!
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